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assuming a game is equally easy to play with either, would you rather use:

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@Felthry depends on whether I'm playing at my desk or on a TV

@noiob i'd say assume that either is an option, as part of the "equally easy to play with either" stipulation
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@Felthry either is an option, it's just more annoying to set up kb+m on a couch, but I already have them at my desk

@noiob i meant more as in you can choose to play the game at the desk or the couch, whichever you prefer
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@Felthry if I'm playing with friends, I'd probably prefer my desk, unless I figure out some way to comfortably use chat apps easily from the hypothetical couch. I'd prefer the couch (I don't have one atm) if I'm just playing single-player

@Felthry depends heavily on genre imo

even ignoring difficulty, different genres feel better with different control schemes

@Felthry i'm actually told that i'm weird for playing games like gungeon with a keyboard+mouse

apparently the game is much easier with a controller but it feels so good with a mouse

@monorail @Felthry twin-stick shooters with kb+m doesn't seem that outlandish to me. In the case of Gungeon, both schemes have their advantages

@monorail i guess some genres just can't be equally easy with either, too, really

dwarf fortress with a controller just plain doesn't make sense
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@Felthry @monorail depends on the controller, sth like the Steam Controller that just straight up comes with trackball emulation would probably work

@noiob @Felthry it would definitely take some practice, which is not something you can usually say about using a game's menus

@monorail @noiob to be fair, dwarf fortress's menus take practice anyway

ui design is not toady one's forte
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@Felthry @noiob i heard somewhere that he has plans to clean up the ui and make the game more accessible

but he wants to do that last so that he doesn't have to do it more than once as things change

so maybe in 2070 it will have a better ui :P

@monorail @noiob that makes sense

as things stand it's nigh unplayable without things like dwarf therapist though
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@Felthry @monorail might be sooner than you expect! current effort is to release DF on steam, and for that the menus all need to be redone to make sense to somewhat more normal ppl

@noiob @monorail dwarf fortress uses keyboard shortcuts very heavily though; even an emulated keyboard would be hard
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@Felthry @monorail you can map a staggering amount of keypresses, macros, whatever to the Steam Controller with key combos and the like, you can even map touch-based menus that'll pop up a visual indicator when used

@noiob @Felthry hm that visual indicator might actually make it work a lot better than i was imagining, you could basically design an emulated controller ui if i'm understanding you correctly

@monorail @Felthry yeah, basically. Valve's CS:GO config maps stuff like votes, opening the buy menu… to a grid on the left touchpad. They also support custom icons. It'd be a bunch of work to set up though

here's an example for the radial variant partner.steamgames.com/doc/fea

@Felthry huh, interesting to me kb+m is doing worse so far - since I'm one of them
just way more... used to it, really, and things like... well, Okami is an extra special case, but that game is so much best played kb+m imo, for example

@Felthry ...I dunno, just something about... I'll try to play games w/ controller on PC sometimes, but it just... doesn't work as well for me

@Felthry all other things being equal, our controller needs to be turned on but our mouse and keyboard don't? if we're talking about factors external to how good a game is to play with each option, that's the big one.

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@Felthry I find it hard to vote here because, to me, no game is "equally easy to play with either". My choice depends on the game in question! I'll basically always want a mouse if the game involves aiming projectile weapons from first/third person frequently...

I have actually used both at once before in a few rare cases! In both Nioh and Let It Die, I primarily play with a controller, but take my right hand off the controller and put it on the mouse to use bows/guns.

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